Romanian Military History Forum - Part of Romanian Army in the Second World War Website



Pages: (2) 1 [2]   ( Go to first unread post ) Reply to this topicStart new topicStart Poll

> Michael the Brave Order, Originals versus Copies
Victor
Posted: June 10, 2007 12:09 pm
Quote Post


Admin
Group Icon

Group: Admin
Posts: 4349
Member No.: 3
Joined: February 11, 2003



QUOTE (hughwbrock @ May 23, 2007 05:15 pm)
Also, the First Class pin back badge: How many 1941's were awarded? From the list on the site, only a few of the highest ranking German generals were awarded the MV. How many Germans total got the First Class MV? Are the names known?

1. Reichsmarschall Hermann Goering: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941

2. Admiral Erich Raeder: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
3. Generalfeldmarschall Braucshitsch: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
4. Generalfeldmarschall Wilhelm Keitel: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
5. Generalfeldmarschall von Rundstedt: 1st class by Royal Decree no. 2550/1 September 1942 (CO Army Group West)
6. Generalfeldmarschall von Bock: 1st class by Royal Decree no. 2550/1 September 1942 (CO Army Group South)
7. Generaloberst Ewald von Kleist: 1st and 2nd classes by Royal Decree no. 3034/6 October 1942 (CO 1st Panzer Army)

Finland:
1. Marshal Carl Gustav Mannerheim: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 3026/1 November 1941

Italy:
1. Marshal Umberto of Savoy: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 1783/26 July 1943 (CO Italian Army Group South)
PMEmail PosterUsers Website
Top
b737
Posted: June 10, 2007 05:36 pm
Quote Post


Plutonier major
*

Group: Members
Posts: 311
Member No.: 390
Joined: November 18, 2004



This is Hermann Göring's set !
You can see also how the first class badge must be.


(IMG:http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/10/g104nb.jpg)
PMEmail Poster
Top
mabadesc
Posted: June 11, 2007 02:59 am
Quote Post


Locotenent colonel
*

Group: Members
Posts: 803
Member No.: 40
Joined: July 11, 2003



QUOTE
1. Reichsmarschall Hermann Goering: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941

2. Admiral Erich Raeder: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
3. Generalfeldmarschall Braucshitsch: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
4. Generalfeldmarschall Wilhelm Keitel: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
5. Generalfeldmarschall von Rundstedt: 1st class by Royal Decree no. 2550/1 September 1942 (CO Army Group West)
6. Generalfeldmarschall von Bock: 1st class by Royal Decree no. 2550/1 September 1942 (CO Army Group South)
7. Generaloberst Ewald von Kleist: 1st and 2nd classes by Royal Decree no. 3034/6 October 1942 (CO 1st Panzer Army)

Finland:
1. Marshal Carl Gustav Mannerheim: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 3026/1 November 1941

Italy:
1. Marshal Umberto of Savoy: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 1783/26 July 1943 (CO Italian Army Group South)


Any idea if any of the first class orders were awarded "with swords"?
PM
Top
Victor
Posted: June 11, 2007 06:11 am
Quote Post


Admin
Group Icon

Group: Admin
Posts: 4349
Member No.: 3
Joined: February 11, 2003



QUOTE (mabadesc @ June 11, 2007 04:59 am)
QUOTE
1. Reichsmarschall Hermann Goering: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941

2. Admiral Erich Raeder: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
3. Generalfeldmarschall Braucshitsch: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
4. Generalfeldmarschall Wilhelm Keitel: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 2868/14 October 1941
5. Generalfeldmarschall von Rundstedt: 1st class by Royal Decree no. 2550/1 September 1942 (CO Army Group West)
6. Generalfeldmarschall von Bock: 1st class by Royal Decree no. 2550/1 September 1942 (CO Army Group South)
7. Generaloberst Ewald von Kleist: 1st and 2nd classes by Royal Decree no. 3034/6 October 1942 (CO 1st Panzer Army)

Finland:
1. Marshal Carl Gustav Mannerheim: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 3026/1 November 1941

Italy:
1. Marshal Umberto of Savoy: 1st, 2nd and 3rd classes by Royal Decree no. 1783/26 July 1943 (CO Italian Army Group South)


Any idea if any of the first class orders were awarded "with swords"?

The MV Order with swords is the 1944 model, instituted after 23 August 1944. All the orders received by Germans during WWII are 1941 models.
PMEmail PosterUsers Website
Top
mabadesc
Posted: June 12, 2007 01:06 am
Quote Post


Locotenent colonel
*

Group: Members
Posts: 803
Member No.: 40
Joined: July 11, 2003



-model 1944: 3 1st class, 10 2nd class, 34 3rd class

This means that the 1st class order currently on sale on the Zeige auction site is one of only 3 ever awarded. Wow, that's pretty rare!
I'm assuming it belonged to one of the Soviet Marshalls...

This post has been edited by mabadesc on June 12, 2007 01:08 am
PM
Top
Victor
Posted: June 12, 2007 05:07 am
Quote Post


Admin
Group Icon

Group: Admin
Posts: 4349
Member No.: 3
Joined: February 11, 2003



Assuming it is original.

The numbers I gave were for orders awarded to foreigners. The King probably also received the new model of the 1st class.
PMEmail PosterUsers Website
Top
hughwbrock
Posted: June 15, 2007 03:12 pm
Quote Post


Soldat
*

Group: Members
Posts: 8
Member No.: 1428
Joined: May 22, 2007



Which WW2 site are you referring to? Would like to view it.
I have only Vernon's Guide (which is useless for this grade) and Stefan, Neculae & Dumitrascu's ROMANIA DECORATII 1859-91.
Perhaps someone can translate the latter for me: "In anul 1941 ordinul a primit pe avers cifrul incoronat al regelui Mihai I si pe bratul inferior asl crucii anul 1941." Again, there is no picture of a first class badge (pin back). As I read it, it says: "In 1941, regulations changed the front to bear the royal cypher of Michael I with at date 1941 on the lower arm of the cross". No mention of the Ferdinand cypher. Please correct me if I am wrong---I don't know any Rumanian.
Anyone have any clear period photos of the badge? The ones I have seen are not that clear, but the badge does not seem to have both cyphers on the front.
PMEmail Poster
Top
hughwbrock
Posted: June 15, 2007 03:14 pm
Quote Post


Soldat
*

Group: Members
Posts: 8
Member No.: 1428
Joined: May 22, 2007



Sorry. Thanks.
PMEmail Poster
Top
mabadesc
Posted: June 27, 2007 05:08 am
Quote Post


Locotenent colonel
*

Group: Members
Posts: 803
Member No.: 40
Joined: July 11, 2003



QUOTE
his means that the 1st class order currently on sale on the Zeige auction site is one of only 3 ever awarded.


I checked the auction site again and the order is no longer there. They either took it offline, or, more likely, it was sold. Whoever bought it, I think it was a good investment for him (assuming it was an original item, as Victor mentioned).
The price was quite moderate too. If I recall correctly, it was going for 3000 or 4000 Euros.
PM
Top
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

Topic Options Pages: (2) 1 [2]  Reply to this topicStart new topicStart Poll

 






[ Script Execution time: 0.0264 ]   [ 14 queries used ]   [ GZIP Enabled ]