Bremen myth or truth?

[U260diver]

According stories from old navy divers sunk in the area of Capul Midia (Navodari) during the second world war a German ship with the name BREMEN.

After my search including Lloyds register no results. Is there any body on this list who know more about this ship. Or can there be a confusion and there is no Bremen existing?

Thanks for any help...

[sid guttridge]

Hi U260,

I have a book giving details of all German merchant ships during WWII. I will check "Bremen" out.

Cheers,

Sid.

[U260diver]

Hi Sid,

Thanks for your effort to do some research for me. I wait for your reaction...

U260diver

[sid guttridge]

Hi U260,

According to Schwadtke's book on the German merchant fleet in WWII, there was only one ship with the name "Bremen".

She was an ocean going liner of 51,731t, and the largest ship in the entire German merchant fleet.

She was sunk due to a fire at Bremerhaven on 18 March 1941.

It therefore seems very unlikely that there is a WWII II German wreck with the name "Bremen" off Cape Midia.

The only caveat is that Schwadtke does not cover smaller vessels like tugs or barges, many of which were used on the Danube. (I think his cut-off point may 1,000 tons). It is therefore still theoretically possible that there was a smaller "Bremen".

Cheers,

Sid.

[U260diver]

Hello Sid,

Many thanks for the info...

In the Topic: S-57 mine barrage, we spoke about the vessel Arkadia and there is mentioned about Norddeutcher Lloyd BREMEN. Is it possible that divers found that name on the wreck (and missed the real name ?? Arkadia??) Its known that Arkadia sunk in the same area. On the bell of a ship is also mentioned name of ship and place?? The divers spoke about anti aircraft guns (20mm) and on artifacts was the Swastika.

16. AMSEL GE 1T (11)
1,756 Norddeutscher Lloyd, Bremen 276.1 x 42.2
C Akt. Ges. "Neptun", Rostock (7) #409
33 - s/o (Argo Reed. A.G., mgr.)
35 - Atlas-Levante Linie A.G. (D. L. L. G.m.b.H.), Bremen
36 - ARKADIA s/o
Mined and sunk 29 April 1943, off Constantza

[sid guttridge]

Hi U260,

From memory, wasn't "Amsel" one of four German tugs used as minesweepers in the Black Sea? I think "Brusterort" and "Drossel" were others.

Cheers,

Sid.

[sid guttridge]

P.S. Yes. the fourth one was the "Forsch".

Sid.

[U260diver]

Hi list...

A while ago i found proof that the so called Bremen was in fact the Arkadia.
On the bell was written Amsel - Bremen, according the Lloyds list was the first name of Arkadia - Amsel with port of registry Bremen.
Last week i was able to localize the wreck and today i made the first dive on this wreck and was lucky to see and touch a piece of Black Sea history with my own eyes. The Arkadia lay between 20 and 30m off depth, she lay almost horizontal and how it looks now the mine hit here near the bridge on port side.
I have a link with some pictures from Arkadia and also some photo's from the dive today. I hope they are interesting and as soon i made some more dives i will post about my investigation on the wreck.


http://www.aquarius-diving.ro/Arkadia.htm

U260diver

[U260diver]

somebody know what the cargo was of the Arkadia??

[Victor]

Wow! Great find!

I will look to see if teh cargo of the Arkadia is mentioned anywhere and will get back to you Thursday evening.

[Victor]

Sorry, I wasn't able to find much, just that it was returning from Sevastopol escorted by 4 R-boote, which rescued the entire crew.

[U260diver]

Hi Victor,

Many thanks for your time and effort, i didn't knew about the fate of the crew
so that's also great info for me.

That the Arkadia was escorted by 4 Raumboats, was that a normal procedure
for just one ship? Can it mean that she had a interesting cargo?

I searched also for the R 36 but till now no success according the coordinates what i have she must lay in the same area as the Arkadia.

The underwater pictures are not from a great quality but unfortunately the visibility
didn't allow me to make better, i hope the next time to shoot some better and for sure i will let you know.



U260diver

[Victor]

Yes, it was standard procedure. Convoys in the Black Sea were usually made up of 1-2 cargo ships and several escorts, because of the high activity of Soviet submarines in the area. My guess that if she was returning from Sevastopol, it was probably empty.

Rb-36 indeed sank in about the same area. It seems there was a problem with the S57 barrage regarding the depth the mines had been laid.

[U260diver]

Victor thanks for the information...

i will put a photo from the Arkadia on the moment that the photo was taken she was called Amsel (her first name)



Thanks to Mr. Sins for this nice photo!

Does somebody have some more information about the Raumboats who served in the Black Sea, technical info, photo's etc. ?

Thanks in advance for any help.

U260diver

[U260diver]

Here you can find some scans from the wreck,

Scans Arkadia


(link update)

This post has been edited by U260diver on May 16, 2011 04:57 pm