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> The Battle of Turda/Torda/Thorenburg, 60 Years Ago...
ANDREAS
Posted: March 09, 2010 01:23 am
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I synthesize and possibly add some information about the German-Hungarian Troops involved in the Turda battle:
- the hungarian 25. Infantry Division with Major General Hollósy-Kuthy László in command and Major Adonyi-Naredy Ferenc as chief of staff, at least 25. and 26. Infantry Regiments mentioned
- the hungarian 2. Armored Division with Major General Zsedényi Zoltán in command and Lieutenant Colonel Rugonyi György as chief of staff, at least the 3. motorized infantry regiment mentioned
flanked by the 7. and 9. Infantry (recruits?) Divisions and 1. and 2. Mountain Brigades, all part of the II. Army Corps of the Hungarian Army.
Later after 18 september the german Panzer Group lead by Lieutenant General Mortimer von Kessel with Sturmgeschütz-Brigade 905, 1015. and 1176. Sturmgeschütz-Abteilungen, 721. Panzerjager Abteilung, III Battalion of Brandenburg Jäger Regiment and several smaller units have strengthened the forces of the II. Army Corps. From 19 september the hungarian 10. Assault Gun Battalion, the german 6. and 1179. Sturmgeschütz/Panzerjager-Abteilungen and the hungarian 3. Armored Regiment and the 52. Armored Antiaircraft Battalion are mentioned in the fighting in the area.
After 23 september, units of the german 23. Panzer Division (Generalleutnant Josef von Radowitz) -126. and 128. Panzergrenadier Regiments and 23. Reconnaissance Battalion with tank support - probably of the 23. Panzer Regiment - 36 Pz.V Panther A and 6 Pz.IV H, 2 Pz.III N, 16 StuG.IV and StuG.III assault guns, and 4 Marder-III, 4 Wespe 105mm and 3 Hummel 150mm SP Howitzers entered the battle but only for short time.
The source - The German 23rd Armoured Division in the Battle at Torda - Számvéber Norbert and A tordai csata - Ravazs István.
I'll also try to rebuild the Soviet-Romanian forces involved in the battle.
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contras
Posted: March 09, 2010 07:13 am
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After I read about it in veterans memories, until the battle at Miraslau, where the German-Hungarian advance was stopped, there were just Romanian border guards and infantery. It is interesting to know OOB.
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ANDREAS
Posted: March 09, 2010 09:00 pm
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The Romanian forces engaged in the battle, reconstructed from the sources already mentioned and the ones I'll say later were:
-for 5 to 8 september 1944 : Cluj Regional Battalion, March Battalion from 83. Infantry Regiment/ 20th Instruction Infantry Division in defense on the demarcation line (south-east of Cluj), other 2 battalions of the 83. Infantry Regiment in Turda area.
Probably some unknown border guard units were also in position.
They went into combat at the outbreak of the Hungarian offensive in September 5th with units of the 9th hungarian Field Replacement Division (identified a regiment from this division as the 34th infantry regiment) attacking from south-east of Apahida and Feleacu areas and the 7th hungarian Field Replacement Division attacking from Gilau-Floresti areas towards Buru and Turda.
I will continue after documenting...
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Zoltan
Posted: December 12, 2011 08:28 pm
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QUOTE (ANDREAS @ March 09, 2010 01:23 am)
I synthesize and possibly add some information about the German-Hungarian Troops involved in the Turda battle:
- the hungarian 25. Infantry Division with Major General Hollósy-Kuthy László in command and Major Adonyi-Naredy Ferenc as chief of staff, at least 25. and 26. Infantry Regiments mentioned
- the hungarian 2. Armored Division with Major General Zsedényi Zoltán in command and Lieutenant Colonel Rugonyi György as chief of staff, at least the 3. motorized infantry regiment mentioned
flanked by the 7. and 9. Infantry (recruits?) Divisions and 1. and 2. Mountain Brigades, all part of the II. Army Corps of the Hungarian Army.
Later after 18 september the german Panzer Group lead by Lieutenant General Mortimer von Kessel with Sturmgeschütz-Brigade 905, 1015. and 1176. Sturmgeschütz-Abteilungen, 721. Panzerjager Abteilung, III Battalion of Brandenburg Jäger Regiment and several smaller units have strengthened the forces of the II. Army Corps. From 19 september the hungarian 10. Assault Gun Battalion, the german 6. and 1179. Sturmgeschütz/Panzerjager-Abteilungen and the hungarian 3. Armored Regiment and the 52. Armored Antiaircraft Battalion are mentioned in the fighting in the area.
After 23 september, units of the german 23. Panzer Division (Generalleutnant Josef von Radowitz) -126. and 128. Panzergrenadier Regiments and 23. Reconnaissance Battalion with tank support - probably of the 23. Panzer Regiment - 36 Pz.V Panther A and 6 Pz.IV H, 2 Pz.III N, 16 StuG.IV and StuG.III assault guns, and 4 Marder-III, 4 Wespe 105mm and 3 Hummel 150mm SP Howitzers entered the battle but only for short time.
The source - The German 23rd Armoured Division in the Battle at Torda - Számvéber Norbert and A tordai csata - Ravazs István.
I'll also try to rebuild the Soviet-Romanian forces involved in the battle.

Hi, do you have any information on the Hungarian 12th mountain batalion at the Battle of Torda? Which mountain brigade did it belong to?

Thanks
István
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ANDREAS
Posted: December 14, 2011 09:45 pm
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I read everything I had about this battle but no, unfortunately, I haven't found any details on the composition of the mountain (replacement) brigades!
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aidan zea
Posted: October 07, 2012 09:08 pm
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http://www.worldwar2.ro/forum/index.php?sh...indpost&p=49411
Florin, here you stand for the fact that Hungary had received in the autumn of 1944 some 25 Tiger tanks, fact that is wrong! Hungary received indeed a relatively limited number of tanks, assault guns, tank destroyers and other armored vehicles from autumn 1944 but no such numbers of Tiger tanks. Practically is unknown if even the three Tiger tanks who is said to have been formally delivered to Magyar Kiralyi Honvedseg in late 1944 were not in fact the only ones remaining from the first (and maybe only) batch of Tiger I tanks, delivered to the 2nd (MKH) Armoured Division in april 1944 when this unit was fighting alongside Germans in the Carpathian Region in south-western Ukraine. It is known that 10 Pzkpfw VI Tiger Ausf. E were delivered to the 3rd Armd. Regiment /2nd (MKH) Armoured Division, unit that fought the Soviet forces until august 1944. This unit did a very nice figure in combat, being appreciated by the Germans, with similar achievements to Wehrmacht elite units! When the 3rd Armd. Regiment was withdrawn from the Galitian front, he had only 3 remaining Pzkpfw VI Tiger Ausf. E! This heavy tanks were used later, in october 1944, in the Debrecen operation, with the 2nd (MKH) Armoured Division!
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Agarici
Posted: October 13, 2013 04:01 pm
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Does anyone knows which was the total number of tanks and AFV involved into the battle, on each side? On the German/Hungarian side we had the Kessel Group, then the 23rd Panzer Division, plus several assault-gun battalions, and the Hungarian 2nd Armoured Division (plus independent SPG battalions?). On the Soviet/Romanian side fought 5th Soviet Guard Tank Corps from the 6th Guard Tank Army and Niculescu/4th Army Armoured Detachment.

What I can say for the beginning is that the strenght of Niculescu Detachment (10 T 4 tanks, 10 TAS and 12 TACAM R 2) was close to a battalion. The question is what was the added up strenght of the 4th Army Armoured Detachment, for the figures indicated here on the site are smaller than the sum of the AFV of Matei and Niculescu detachments formed earlier in August 1944.
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sylviashea
Posted: January 21, 2018 07:58 pm
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Hi! Thanks for sharing this post! It's essential! To be honest, I did not know about the total number of tanks and AFV involved into the battle!
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