German panzers given to Romania

[88mm]

I have loocked over the topic about german material and I found a list of german panzers given to us. I want to know which models of panzer III or IV was about. Ex: Pz III (E,G,H,J,N)?

Regards.

[dragos]

The Germans delivered to Romanian Army:

- 26 Pz35(t)
- 50 Pz38(t)
- 11 PzIIIN
- 121 Pz IV (H mostly, G more than 11, others unknown)
- 108 StugIIIF

edited

[mabadesc]

Does this represent the total number of tanks GIVEN to Romania by Germany or the total number given and sold (and exchanged for other goods)?

Considering the thousands of tanks produced by Germany and the high involvement of Romanian troops, I'm surprised that the number was so low.

[Hohenstaufen]

that's not all, Germany also delivered well over 70 long-barreled PzIV's at the end of 1943, which variants? I don't know... but I hope someone will shed a light on this

[dragos]

I'll try to figure out the exact number of Pz IV delivered to Romanian Army.

[MaxFax]

I don't remember where from, I know that we have had also PzKpfw IV Ausf.H ?! Isn't it true ?!

[Geto-Dacul]

On 19th August 1944, we had 81 Panzer IV's. Most of them were PzKpfw IVH, but there were numbers of F2s and Js among them.

G-D.

[dragos]

I have found that in the 1943-1944 period, 110 serviceable Pz IV tanks were delivered to Romanian Army, most of them being Pz IV H, some Pz IV G, other types unknown. These tanks were distributed in the following manner: 30 in the "Cantemir" Group (24 Feb 1944), 32 in "Detasamentul Blindat Rapid" - Fast Armoured Detachment (28 March 1944), 48 in the 1st Armoured Division.

The actual number of Pz IV tanks requested from the Germans, as part of the Olivenbaum program, was bigger, probably over 140, but the delivery was slow and eventually cancelled in August 1944.

The situation looks like:

- 26 Pz35(t)
- 50 Pz38(t)
- 11 Pz III N
- 121 Pz IV (H mostly, G more than 11, others unknown)
- 108 StugIIIF

[Dénes]

Approx. 10-12 Pz. Kpfw. V Panther tanks, initially assigned to be delivered to the Rumanian Army in the early September of 1944, were eventually given to the Hungarian Army due to the Rumanians' defection.
These Panthers were then employed in combat by the Honvédség, in Transylvania, against Rumanian and Soviet units.

Dénes

[Der Maresal]

...and rightfully so...!

If the Germans were giving Panthers to their faithfull allies at this late stage of the war....why did the Russians did not provide us with Josef Stalin 2 heavy tanks or KV-85...to "reward" us for having allied ourselves with the "valiant red army" and for having been "liberated from the fascist chains"?
Did they give us their lates tanks? NO! ...
...and they had tousands of them too...not like the germans.. :wink:

:idea:

[mabadesc]

What else would you expect from the Soviet Army? They took around 130000 romanian soldiers as Prisoners AFTER August 23, when they were allies and romanian troops were retreating without fighting.
Plus, for the remainder of the war, they kept diverting food and supplies from villages and towns captured by the Romanian Army over to their troops.

[Geto-Dacul]

QUOTE

...and they had tousands of them too...not like the germans...

Tens of thousands!!!

Der Maresal wrote :

QUOTE

why did the Russians did not provide us with Josef Stalin 2 heavy tanks or KV-85...

Actually, the Soviets produced only 130 KV-85! And most of them were knocked out on the Vistula in middle 1944, by the Hermann Goering Panzer Division!
http://www.nemo.nu/ibisportal/5pansar/5sid...bilder/kv85.jpg
http://www.nemo.nu/ibisportal/5pansar/5index.htm

[PanzerKing]

By 1944/45 the Russians could have literally give the Romanians hundreds of T-34/85s and JS tanks. The production numbers were enormous! Over 40,000 T-34's were built alone through out the war.

[Bernard Miclescu]

Betwwen 100 000 and 162 000 romanian soldiers were made POW between 23/08/1944 and 07/09/44 because "any treaty was yet signed between the Red Army and the new Romanian governement"

So nothing from the Russians even with the declaration of Molotov on 12/04/1944

B Miclescu

[Csaba Becze]

Dénes,

This 'story' about the 10-12 Panthers are not confirmed by official sources. Just 5 Panthers were in Hungarian Army in August, 1944, not 10-12, and this 5 was sent directly to Hungary, this panzers were not 'confiscated' tanks (the Magyar Királyi Honvédség Fegyverzete book isn't perfect...). In 1945 1-2 new Panthers arrived also, as I mentioned before.

The 108 StugIIIF sounds interesting for me. The Rumanian Infantry Divisions had Assault Gun battailons or other units used this panzers?

Csaba