Unknown Person. Civil holder of the MV.
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| WorldWar2.ro Forum > Awards & Badges > Order of Mihai Viteazul Civil Holders |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 04, 2004 05:38 pm |
| The book by Colonel Eugen Ichim, "Ordinul Militar De Razboi Mihail Viteazul" is an excellent book on the military holders of the Order of Michael the Brave. However, what about the Civil holders :?: Is there a list just like in this book that identifies the Civil holders awarded the Michael the Brave, Dates of when they received the awards, and for what distinction they were awarded this Order :?: Where there any Civilians who held the First and Second Class of the Order :?:
Unknown Person. Civil holder of the MV. |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 04, 2004 05:40 pm |
Unknown Person. Civil holder of the MV Order. Court photographer Julietta. |
| Posted by: CCJ July 04, 2004 05:51 pm |
| Awesome photos! Has anyone ever seen one of these capes before?
I did not know a civilian could be awarded the MV... unless he was performing some sort of brave act during a military action :question: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR, you need a special place of your own on this site to show off your collection. It is most impressive. |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 04, 2004 05:57 pm |
| The Military Museum In Bucharest has a hat and cape on display for a civilian holder identical to these photos. Civilians wore a white wool cap. |
| Posted by: Carol I July 04, 2004 06:01 pm | ||
I guess all the holders of the Order of Michael the Brave must have been in the military when they have received the award. The civilian holders in your photos were most likely reserve officers who were mobilised for the war and who returned to their peacetime occupation afterwards. |
| Posted by: Carol I July 04, 2004 06:04 pm | ||
Take a look at the topic below for photos of the surviving WWII knights of the Order of Michael the Brave in full attire. http://worldwar2.ro/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1167 |
| Posted by: Carol I July 04, 2004 06:12 pm | ||
Here is an image of the cape on display in the http://muzeu.mapn.ro/ 
Source: http://muzeu.mapn.ro/sectii2.htm#contemporana |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 04, 2004 06:20 pm |
Here is another photo of the same cape. If you see this cape up close in person, you would be horrified as to the condition. Over the years on display at the Museum, the sunlight and cigarette smoke has turned this cape yellow with severe stains. |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 04, 2004 06:25 pm |
| In photo #1, The person is wearing a Civil Crown neck Order 2nd class with 1930's Blue and white ribbon and a Civil Crown Officer class breast star. No other orders and medals present. I am also told that these individuals were in the Romanian Senate but cannot confirm identity. |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 05, 2004 05:44 pm |
One of my favorite MV award pieces - The MV ring. |
| Posted by: CCJ July 05, 2004 06:00 pm |
| That is a NICE ring. :keep: |
| Posted by: Carol I July 06, 2004 07:40 am |
| It's the first time that I hear about a Michael the Brave ring. Is it an official item or a privately made one? |
| Posted by: mihai July 08, 2004 03:39 am | ||
That's great!This is good example of the cloak set of Knighthood of MV This cloakset was instituted in 1936. Mihai |
| Posted by: CCJ July 09, 2004 12:49 am |
| I think those cloaks are very nice. Does anyone here own one? Would be a nice item to have. |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 09, 2004 04:15 am |
Order Of Mihai Viteazul Cape in my collection. |
| Posted by: CCJ July 09, 2004 04:18 am |
Awesome 
What else have you to show? Do you have any MV orders? I would also enjoy seeing visor caps and other headgear. :beer: |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 09, 2004 04:19 am |
Frontal Order patch insignia is made from a very high quality velvet material with bullion wire embroidery. |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 09, 2004 04:22 am |
Colar patch on MV Cape. |
| Posted by: CCJ July 09, 2004 04:27 am |
| I am glad you have shown the detail of the collar. I had no idea there is a bullion pattern to the patches. |
| Posted by: mihai July 09, 2004 01:42 pm | ||
Is this cape-clack set M1936type? Do you have original cap of M1936 Type? Mihai |
| Posted by: mihai July 09, 2004 01:43 pm | ||
That's great items! Can you see the scan that the clak's backside? Mihai |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 09, 2004 02:19 pm |
| Cape is original Model 1936. In prestine mint condition. Bucharest Makers label inside. Purple red polished silk / cotton lining. Back side is all white. Unfortunately, I do not have the hat or chain clasp that attaches to the front of the cape. This cape was awarded to a military Colonel. |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR July 17, 2004 02:56 pm |
Interesting photo which I cannot identify the individuals. Center person is a retired General. I have seen him before in photos. His son is to the left of him in the photo. Both young officers are highly decorated Guard Regiment officers of Lietentant and Second Lietenant. Both are awarded the Order of Mihai Viteazul - Michael the Brave 1941 and have the German Iron Cross 1st and 3rd class orders. The Second Lietenant on the right side has 4 wound stripes on his sleeve. They are also wearing the Order of the Star 2nd class with swords and the Order of the Crown 2nd class with swords. Any ideas on who these people are ? :?: |
| Posted by: b737 March 04, 2005 06:42 pm | ||
I think that this gentelman was a member of the parlament because I see the breast star of the Romanian Eagle Order( great officer grade)! |
| Posted by: mihai May 14, 2005 12:55 pm |
| What order is in neck of This Civic hloder? Mihai |
| Posted by: mihai May 14, 2005 12:58 pm | ||
THis is great piece, Mihai |
| Posted by: Carol I May 14, 2005 05:03 pm |
| I have never heard about a "Michael the Brave ring". Is it an official issue, a privately made ring or a fantasy item? |
| Posted by: mihai May 15, 2005 01:57 am | ||
Exactly,I'm interested in the ring,This is officeal on e or wearer's copy? Mihai |
| Posted by: Carol I August 21, 2005 03:24 pm |
| Civilian and military holders of the Order of Michael the Brave at a parade in Bucharest. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6202470561 Source: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6202470561 |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR August 21, 2005 11:59 pm |
| All the civil holders wear the white fur cap. These individuals are probably members of parliament or senate. |
| Posted by: Carol I August 22, 2005 06:47 pm | ||
What makes you say that? |
| Posted by: REGAL UNIFORMA COLECTOR August 23, 2005 02:00 am |
| It is only a guess. I do not know what other civilians would have been awarded the Michael the Brave order and no one has yet to explain why a civilian would have received such an order. I think that some members of parliament and senate received this order when they aligned themselves with Germany in 1941. This photo was taken when Romania became an axis power with Germany and Germany entered into Romania. The book "Ordinul Militar De Razboi Mihai Viteazul" by Colonel Eugen Ichim only makes reference to military holders of the order. I have not seen any photos of Civil holders pre-1941. Perhaps it had something to do with Romania becoming an Axis power. |
| Posted by: Victor August 23, 2005 05:18 am |
| Reservists also received the order during wartime. This may be the motive there are civilians wearing it. |
| Posted by: Carol I August 23, 2005 06:24 am | ||
According to the regulations, the Order of Michael the Brave was awarded only to officers for outstanding military achievements in wartime. It is therefore not likely that someone - even less a civilian - has received it as a peacetime courtesy sign. On the other hand, if I remember right it was not required that the persons receiving it to be career officers. It is therefore possible that the civilians in the photo were under arms during WWI - as reservists called for duty or as volunteers - and have then received the Order of Michael the Brave (as Victor also said). Then, when the war was over, they left the army and returned to their civilian activities. Thus, it is not surprising that civilians were wearing the order in 1940 or 1941. |
| Posted by: Carol I August 23, 2005 06:39 am | ||
Most likely it is the Order of the Crown of Romania. |
| Posted by: mihai October 15, 2005 03:35 am |
| http://img407.imageshack.us/my.php?image=kr6346jx.jpg This photos came from e-bay seller"merenti" it's good photo Mihai |
| Posted by: Dénes October 15, 2005 03:55 am | ||
Mihai-san, the link is not working. Is this the photo you are referring to? Gen. Dénes  |
| Posted by: Carol I October 15, 2005 07:47 am |
| The link given by Mihai does not work, but the address is correct. You just need to do a 'Copy/Paste operation' and you will get the image I http://www.worldwar2.ro/forum/index.php?showtopic=1170&view=findpost&p=37460. |
| Posted by: Dénes October 15, 2005 02:00 pm |
| Yes, it's just what I exactly did. Gen. Dénes |
| Posted by: Carol I October 15, 2005 09:57 pm |
 According to the http://www.worldwar2.ro/forum/index.php?showtopic=1404&view=findpost&p=39535 provided by Kepi, this photo was taken during the parade of 8 November 1941. |
| Posted by: Kepi October 17, 2005 08:38 am | ||
The ring was carried, as a personal jewel, by the Guard Division (“DG”) officers. The presence of “Michael the Brave” order on the ring could be explained by the fact that all the division regiments have received this highest military order. The National Military Museum has several similar items. (Courtesy by Professor Cornel Andonie) http://imageshack.us http://imageshack.us http://imageshack.us |
| Posted by: boonicootza October 17, 2005 01:12 pm |
| Thanks for the info Kepi! |
| Posted by: Carol I October 17, 2005 05:41 pm | ||
Thanks, Kepi, for this update. Could you tell if this ring was a privately made item or an official one? I mean, was its use introduced officially into the Guard Division? If it were a private item, then the chances are that there are a lot of variations, e.g., depending on the jewellers who made them. On the other hand, an official item must have had some strict specifications and therefore there were fewer variations. These two rings are almost identical, suggesting some sort of a "mass production", but on the other hand two is quite a poor sample. |
| Posted by: Kepi October 23, 2005 06:52 am |
| It was a great variety concerning the Romanian military insignia (regimental and qualification badges), even for those adopted by Royal Decrees and had an approved design. These badges were produced by different jewelers in small quantities (a few tens), probably at different periods, so differences could exists between items. Other badges as the small chain-amulets (“Martisoare”), cuff links or rings, were an absolutely private initiative of the officers of a particular regiment, especially for some famous/elite units, such as the Guard, cavalry, mountain troops, etc. In my opinion this ring is a typical example of a privately design and acquired military item. They were not officially issued but were tolerated by senior officers as strengthen the unit “Esprit de Corps”. As far as know, the rings in the Military Museum are all identical. |
| Posted by: Carol I October 23, 2005 11:15 am |
| Thanks for these latest details on the rings of the Guard Division. |