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| WorldWar2.ro Forum > WW1 and Regional Wars (1912-1919) > Actual Rail Gun/Armoured Train? |
| Posted by: Morar Andrei November 21, 2017 07:06 pm |
| In the 1978 Romanian war movie "Ecaterina Teodoroiu", there is a scene after she escapes from the Germans when the Romanians are involved in destroying a German rail artillery piece that was threatening Târgu Jiu. Same story appears in our 4th class history books at school, being cosidered the source of her nickname "The Jiu Heroine", but there is no mention about this episode in any of her official biography, also being no mention about any German or Austro-Hungarian rail artillery used on this specific section of the front, neither in 1916 or 1917. Unfortunately, I can not remember the minute in the movie where that appears, but I want to know how real is that episode, shredded in mistery and Communist propaganda? Does it have anything true as an origin, or was inspired from? I searched on a list of German rail guns from WW1, but none looks to be used on the Romanian front. |
| Posted by: Agarici November 25, 2017 09:34 pm |
| Or, dear Andrei, you were looking for a wrong "nationality" in the case of the said armored train. In an academic military history series ("Istoria militara a poporului roman", Ed. Militara, 6 volumes) published before 1989, in the 5th volume (dedicated to WW 1) there was a picture with AN AUSTRIAN(HUNGARIAN) ARMORED TRAIN on the Transylvanian front, in 1916. It might also fit the story involving E. Teodoroiu and the actions on tha Jiu Valley. |
| Posted by: Florin November 27, 2017 04:40 am |
| In 1978 the socialist Hungary was still "friend" with socialist Romania, so everywhere in the Romanian socialist propaganda of the moment, from Romanian movies to the comics of "Cutezătorii" magazine, the Romanian soldiers were fighting with German soldiers only. This addresses both previous comments. |
| Posted by: Morar Andrei November 27, 2017 03:47 pm |
| Indeed, the Austro-Hungarian army used at least one armoured train during the counter-offensive from the autumn of 1916. But both in the movie and the story, the owners of the armoured train were the Germans. So, this may be a bit a bit puzzleing. More than that, in the biographies of the "Jiu Heroine" there is no mention of destroyung such a weapon, which would lead to the question if that episode actually happened, was a product of the communist propaganda or had a truth as origin. Here is a fragment from Dumitru Almaș' story: |
| Posted by: JiriTintera November 30, 2017 07:53 pm |
| Dear Sirs, I'm put forward a couple of links. Photo Gallery - Imperial War Museum Photo of Austro-Hungarian Armored Trains not found. The German Army in the Romanian campaign, 1916-1918 http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205081469 http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205081470 http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205081471 Photo collection - Das Bundesarchiv, Germany Photo of Austro-Hungarian Armored Trains in Romania not found. Im Osten, Karpaten.- Ein mit Astwerk getarnter Panzerzug an einer Bahnstation. 1915 Frühling (In the east, Carpathians.- An armored train, camouflaged with branches, at a railway station. 1915 spring) https://www.bild.bundesarchiv.de/dev01/barchpic/2012/08-27/79/f4/d0/athene-666wshzzzmgb3p3k3ud_layout.jpg Photo collection - Austrian Kriegsarchiv in Vienna Panzerzug IV, der beim rumänischen Einfall in Brasso gute Dienste leistete, auf der Station in Schäßburg. 30.09.1916 (Armoured Train No. IV, which served well during the Romanian invasion of Brasso, at the station in Schässburg. 30.09.1916) http://www.archivinformationssystem.at/detail.aspx?ID=2014687 |
| Posted by: Petre December 02, 2017 06:35 pm |
| Few days ago, on a TV program, was a little story about the first pieces of National Mil. Museum. An Austro-Hungarian " Mortar - train " ... who threatened Tg. Jiu rail-station. This big weapon is somewhere at The Nat.Mil.Museum, in good condition, nice paint ... So, ask at the Museum. |
| Posted by: Petre December 03, 2017 06:50 am |
| http://smap.mapn.ro/muzeumilitar/expozitii/325.html |
| Posted by: Agarici December 06, 2017 10:56 am | ||
Indeed, this was the photo from the book I was talking about. The train was labeled as being in action in Transylvania in 1916. Thank you, Jiri! http://www.archivinformationssystem.at/detail.aspx?ID=2014687 |
| Posted by: Morar Andrei December 22, 2017 10:36 pm |
| Can you please give me a link to that certain TV program? I know there are 2 rail pieces at the National Military Museun: a 380mm Skoda Howitzer Nr.2 "Godrun" and a 420mm Haubitze. Both have been captured by the Romanian Army at Gyor in 1919 during the Hungarian-Romanian War. I know these two have been used on the Italian front, not in Romania. |
| Posted by: Petre December 23, 2017 06:20 pm |
| I don't remember exactly what TV chanel was. A news one. But the programs come and ... go. I remember it was an interview whit somebody in the garden at Nat. Mil. Museum ... and at first search I found the gun, except for the story. That's all. |
| Posted by: Morar Andrei December 27, 2017 12:18 pm |
| Finally got an image from the movie. Sorry for bad resolution... http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_2017_12/Screenshot_2017-12-27-01-50-47.png.a3f080b5b79a70e27321384088e8ce9b.png |
| Posted by: Morar Andrei January 26, 2018 08:16 pm |
| Well...is this the end of the story? |
| Posted by: Morar Andrei February 25, 2018 04:07 pm |
| Finally, something that can make this story more clear: If there was no armoured train I used during the battle for Târgu Jiu, was the story invented by the communist propaganda machine in order to create character development for Ecaterina? Because, as I already mentioned, only just in the movie from 1978 and the the story "Ecaterina Teodoroiu, the Jiu Heroine" from the novels book "Historic Tales" - which is a large source of historucal innacuracies, overglorified characters and communist propaganda (last stories in the series were even talking about how mighty were the "soviet liberators" and dictator Nicolae Ceaușescu). The truth is that, during the communist regime, there was a large heroes' coult and accent put on nationalism, the Jiu Heroine being one of the main characters who got a lot of mysticism during this era. I also got a photo of the armoured train and rail gun as they are depicted in the 1978 movie (sorry forow quality, it was hard to get), together with images from "Historic Tales": |